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okay so were going to get started here were only two minutes in so Im hoping that all our alumni are slowly getting on to get a clock out on your lunch hour okay well its great to see everybody on today so do you want to get started Michael dont you well start with the five types of so were doing pairing typefaces two symbols for logo type design yeah this is one that comes up frequently and we cover this a little bit in our mark my word workshop but I get to you know request for Chris on these all the time and theres a balance there of you know symbol to type and first I want to just show you that five different types of logos that we usually bring it up with clients to say okay which one you think are you looking for whats in your head and then we kind of give our two cents on depending on their competition in their industry where we think would be more effective to you know do this other type of you know mark or symbol rather than you know another one so anyway Rachels goi