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[Music] kyle is with us in montgomery alabama hey kyle welcome to the ramsey show hey there dave hey ken thanks for taking my call today sure whats up well my wife and i found the baby steps about four years ago and we were fortunate enough to start on baby step three uh since then weve taught fpu two times but we we are still hesitant to uh cut up the credit cards and close the accounts we have that fear of fraudulent debit card uh purchases and ive heard you talk about it before in the past about the protections between debit and credit cards yeah please please own research go ahead go ahead im sure my own research uh following hearing those episodes i have uh looked into it and found anecdotal evidence that people suffer when their debit cards get misused and then the banks take a while or they may try to refuse the refunds by those fraudulent charges do you have any input or any other protections out there that you would suggest to help prevent those to help us get over that fe